recommend me some geo settings

Lukeyboi89 · Jan 27, 2015

hi all,

the car is booked in for a geo check and adjust so was wondering what people recomment for fast road / slight track use?

the car has buddyclub n+ coilovers, mugen front and rear struts, and spc rear camber arms...

its currently got an aggressive camber on the back, so much so that the inner rear tyres have worn excessively and need replacing, would rather that not happen in the future...

what settings do you guys use?

cheers

Luke

FireDance · Jan 27, 2015

Go to TGM & get it done 8)

beppe786 · Jan 27, 2015

i would only get it done on a hunter machine.. then you know its spot on..

donzooo · Jan 27, 2015

Toe kills tyres not camber.

You will find your toe is way out.

Lukeyboi89 · Jan 27, 2015

FireDance said:
Go to TGM & get it done 8)

haha, [SIZE=13.63636302948px]ok so one TGM fanboy comment, i am up north so not travelling all the way down there for a geo setup...[/SIZE]

area motorsport run their civic cup cars quite well and they set my ep3 up nicely...

Donald_TSC said:
Toe kills tyres not camber.

You will find your toe is way out.

ah that makes more sense, thank you

sooo.... has anyone got any actual recommended settings instead of spam?

cheers

donzooo · Jan 27, 2015

Common settings are

1 deg negative camber all round.
1mm toe in at the back
1mm toe out at the front

Or

Front.
Zero toe.
1.5 degrees negative camber.

Rear.
2.0mm toe in.
1.0 degrees negative camber.

There are a lot of variations on the set up so it's not a "one size fits all". Have a chat with whoever is doing it for you.

I myself run 0.05degree toe in at front because I do long journeys and like having a bit more straight line stability.

mike.williams · Jan 27, 2015

The buddyclub coilover range are probably the only coils that have the better ratio of spring rates more suited for this chassis. All others are too soft in the rear and will cause under steer, on the N+ the rears are still a touch soft at 14k, but they are not full track suspension. I have N+, I am fitting 16k rear springs too mine and a larger rear anti roll bar.

Standard from factory rear spring rates are double the front.

Id go with the 2nd one mentioned above.

Toe out isnt necessary for front. Even on track as it can cause instability and generally the tracks are too fast to gain any benefit from it

More front camber should help the car rotate better.

If you will be seeing the track i would say

1deg rear 2mm total toe in
2 deg front 0 toe, ( anywhere between 1.8-2 will be good) tyre grip dependant, stickier tyres will want more. A good rule off thumb is run the rear camber at half of the front.

Ill be setting my toe the same as this but 3.5 camber front and 1.7-1.8 rear. Basically the least i can get due to my tyre width and wheel offset

Obviously just my opinion, but my opinion is better than "get a FRSU", i hate that term

*** just to note make sure they over torque the lower strut bolt as its slotted on the N+ and could slip unless its set to max camber which is around 3 deg.

Depending how far north you are pay a visit to stevie at grinspeed in leyland, preston. Top guy still using string method. Ex rally car technician. Say no more

Lukeyboi89 · Jan 28, 2015

mike.williams said:
The buddyclub coilover range are probably the only coils that have the better ratio of spring rates more suited for this chassis. All others are too soft in the rear and will cause under steer, on the N+ the rears are still a touch soft at 14k, but they are not full track suspension. I have N+, I am fitting 16k rear springs too mine and a larger rear anti roll bar.

Standard from factory rear spring rates are double the front.

Id go with the 2nd one mentioned above.

Toe out isnt necessary for front. Even on track as it can cause instability and generally the tracks are too fast to gain any benefit from it

More front camber should help the car rotate better.

If you will be seeing the track i would say

1deg rear 2mm total toe in
2 deg front 0 toe, ( anywhere between 1.8-2 will be good) tyre grip dependant, stickier tyres will want more. A good rule off thumb is run the rear camber at half of the front.

Ill be setting my toe the same as this but 3.5 camber front and 1.7-1.8 rear. Basically the least i can get due to my tyre width and wheel offset

Obviously just my opinion, but my opinion is better than "get a FRSU", i hate that term

*** just to note make sure they over torque the lower strut bolt as its slotted on the N+ and could slip unless its set to max camber which is around 3 deg.

Depending how far north you are pay a visit to stevie at grinspeed in leyland, preston. Top guy still using string method. Ex rally car technician. Say no more

thanks mike!

a lot of useful info there,

i will take this stuff with me tonight when i speak to area

cheers

mike.williams · Jan 28, 2015

Lukeyboi89 said:
thanks mike!

a lot of useful info there,

i will take this stuff with me tonight when i speak to area

cheers

No problem mate

Area motorsport? They seem to have the correct spring ratio on their yellow speed track spec coils. 8k/16k.

Alignment will vary person to person and for car requirements. The above i have given is what ill be setting mine up too.

They have more experience so there is no right or wrong just what feels best in terms of getting the car to do what you want it to at the end of the day

beppe786 · Jan 28, 2015

mike.williams said:
1deg rear 2mm total toe in
2 deg front 0 toe, ( anywhere between 1.8-2 will be good) tyre grip dependant, stickier tyres will want more. A good rule off thumb is run the rear camber at half of the front.

just interested to know why is it good to have half camber at the back?

i run slight tow out at the front help taction

mike.williams · Jan 28, 2015

Beppe said:
just interested to know why is it good to have half camber at the back?

i run slight tow out at the front help taction

In terms of rotation having less rear camber and a stiff-ish rear end will have the car turning nicely. Increases the rear camber can be used to tweek rotation/oversteer to reduce it.

This is a nice little article to read

http://winhpde.com/track-alignment/

Toe out in the front can make our chassis very grabby, and potentially emphasise bumpsteer due to the poor mcpherson strut design

mike.williams · Jan 28, 2015

Forgot to add its also to do with roll motion,

The rear roll motion is double the front. I think its around 0.5:1 so under the same compression the rear camber will be double

This can be seen when the car is jacked up the rears will camber out a lot more than the fronts.

There are some good threads floating around clubrsx and hondatech regarding our chassis

beppe786 · Jan 28, 2015

i'm running 2 deg camber ll around

rear tow in and front tow out slightly

FWD car when accelerating it pulls the wheels in and you have 0 tow

everyone like it setup different :xyes: plus loads of fast roundabouts in milton keynes

mike.williams · Jan 28, 2015

Yes you making good power.

my last alignment was towing out in the front. I have castor bushes but also doing some custom work to increase castor further as the chassis has next to none. Castor will improve stability when running alot of camber

Ill be doing zero toe up front and going from there

donzooo · Jan 28, 2015

mike.williams said:
No problem mate

Area motorsport? They seem to have the correct spring ratio on their yellow speed track spec coils. 8k/16k.

Alignment will vary person to person and for car requirements. The above i have given is what ill be setting mine up too.

They have more experience so there is no right or wrong just what feels best in terms of getting the car to do what you want it to at the end of the day

What spring rates do you reckon for a normal Fast Road and occasional track use (once or twice a year)?

I am close to buying 8kg/10kg but this is making me reconsider...

maxvr6 · Jan 28, 2015

mike.williams said:
Yes you making good power.

my last alignment was towing out in the front. I have castor bushes but also doing some custom work to increase castor further as the chassis has next to none. Castor will improve stability when running alot of camber

Ill be doing zero toe up front and going from there

Custom camber plates buddy? I think Wingnutz did the same, i cant be arsed with the hassle lol

My suspension is being fitted soon along with caster bushes, my previous settings were...

2mm total toe out front
2mm total toe out rear
2.1 neg camber front
2.2 neg camber rear

The car is very "grabby" and bump steers all over the place, but tbh that was only ever meant to be a track setup. I want to set mine up for a balance between "fast road" and track, and reduce the ridiculous inner tyre wear im getting on the front, so the plan is...

0mm total toe front
2mm total toe in rear
1.8 neg camber rear
1.8 neg camber front

Then see how i get on with it... maybe i'll reduce camber on the rear if i can get away with it with my new wheel and tyre combo i've planned if i need more rotation.

mike.williams · Jan 28, 2015

Donald_TSC said:
What spring rates do you reckon for a normal Fast Road and occasional track use (once or twice a year)?

I am close to buying 8kg/10kg but this is making me reconsider...

The settings and spring rates am i talking about a more for track use.

What coilovers are you buying?

If you are mostly doing road driving with the occasional trackday then them rates should be ok as you will want some level of comfort but not wanting the car bouncing everywhere.

With them rates you could increase the rear anti roll bar size which would stiffen up the rear end just like stiffer springs would but without sacrificing the road holding. That would be your best option.

I only have experience with 10k/14k and it can get a little bouncy on the road.

mike.williams · Jan 28, 2015

maxvr6 said:
Custom camber plates buddy? I think Wingnutz did the same, i cant be arsed with the hassle lol

My suspension is being fitted soon along with caster bushes, my previous settings were...

2mm total toe out front
2mm total toe out rear
2.1 neg camber front
2.2 neg camber rear

The car is very "grabby" and bump steers all over the place, but tbh that was only ever meant to be a track setup. I want to set mine up for a balance between "fast road" and track, and reduce the ridiculous inner tyre wear im getting on the front, so the plan is...

0mm total toe front
2mm total toe in rear
1.8 neg camber rear
1.8 neg camber front

Then see how i get on with it... maybe i'll reduce camber on the rear if i can get away with it with my new wheel and tyre combo i've planned if i need more rotation.

New alignment plan sounds better, the castor bushes will stabilise the car more, thats one thing i noticed. 2 deg up front would be fine. It will be the toe that has killed the inner tyre.

If i was you i would try and reduce the rear camber as much as you can and increase the rear stiffness by using a thicker ARB if you havent already. Standard arb is fine for the front upgrading is not necessary

Have a read of the article i posted^^

maxvr6 · Jan 28, 2015

mike.williams said:
New alignment plan sounds better, the castor bushes will stabilise the car more, thats one thing i noticed. 2 deg up front would be fine. It will be the toe that has killed the inner tyre.

If i was you i would try and reduce the rear camber as much as you can and increase the rear stiffness by using a thicker ARB if you havent already. Standard arb is fine for the front upgrading is not necessary

Have a read of the article i posted^^

Will have to see what the rear clearance is like once the new wheels and tyres arrive, spring rates will be 8k/12k and already have a Progress ARB on the rear

I did think about the front ARB and agree with you i dont think it needs upgrading, maybe down the line i might think different but for now the bushes and drop links are also in very good condition so i'll leave as is.

Edit, oh and i must have read a thousand websites about geo now but i'll have a read anyway, everyday is a school day when it comes to geo!

Crazylegs · Jan 28, 2015

I'd just like to add.

I've seen Mike's DC5 on track and it handles amazing so his setup must be decent.

Guess running a decent suspension setup etc also helps.

recommend me some geo settings

Advanced Member

Advanced Member

Beppe

Advanced Member

Advanced Member

Advanced Member

Advanced Member

Advanced Member

Advanced Member

Beppe

Advanced Member

Advanced Member

Beppe

Advanced Member

Advanced Member

Advanced Member

Advanced Member

Advanced Member

Advanced Member

Advanced Member