Light rear end

Flevondov

Member
Messages
40
Went on a wet track day and back of the car felt very tail happy,
Understand weather conditions were not great but chasing other ep3s and watching them stay in a straight line felt like something isn’t right here
Any suggestions
Would better rear arb and bushes help ? Thanks
Makes for a cool gif though haha 9ABEA8BD-0EBB-43EA-8FA6-E83B92A82B5D.gif
 

carl hammond

Advanced Member
Messages
3,737
So many variables to consider, these cars are light for their size and have to be driven smoothly.

Things to consider:

Your current setup (tyres, suspension, geo, line taken in and out the corner, when you put the power on and also how delicate you were and smooth transitioning from entrance to exit).

They give lift off oversteer naturally like the DC2 does which is great if you know how to handle it and want that, if not you need to tweak things.

So what tyres do you have?
What is your current geo?
What suspension are you running and spring rates etc?

Personally I love lift off oversteer and generally try to force my car to do it regularly

A car will pitch up when you hit the throttle (the front rises and weight shifts to the back) and pitch down when you hit the brakes as the weight shifts forward lightening the rear as the front dips down.

If you’re turning too early whilst breaking or just after the rear will be slightly unsettled, also as the car rolls leaning away from the corner causing a roll.

With cars If the axis of rotation is behind the centre of the car, the car will understeer. If its in front of the centre of the car, then the car will oversteer.

Oversteer (which you are getting) usually means you unsettled the car mid corner, the only way you can get around the corner smoothly is by keeping the car balanced mid corner which is the key to driving fast and cleanly! When the car is balanced mid corner, it's not over rotating or under rotating and points just where you want it to go!

Don’t go throwing parts at it as you’ll be throwing money away mate
 

Flevondov

Member
Messages
40
Thanks for the replies
Yeah think I’ll probs get a frsu geo done when iv got time and take it a bit easier in the wet trying not to unbalance it as much haha, car is good in the dry
And yeah at the end of the session was fun playing with the liftoff oversteer


D252686B-1B47-4524-AAE0-17963C32CD90.gif
 

Attachments

JordanSuth

Advanced Member
Messages
225
So many variables to consider, these cars are light for their size and have to be driven smoothly.

Things to consider:

Your current setup (tyres, suspension, geo, line taken in and out the corner, when you put the power on and also how delicate you were and smooth transitioning from entrance to exit).

They give lift off oversteer naturally like the DC2 does which is great if you know how to handle it and want that, if not you need to tweak things.

So what tyres do you have?
What is your current geo?
What suspension are you running and spring rates etc?

Personally I love lift off oversteer and generally try to force my car to do it regularly

A car will pitch up when you hit the throttle (the front rises and weight shifts to the back) and pitch down when you hit the brakes as the weight shifts forward lightening the rear as the front dips down.

If you’re turning too early whilst breaking or just after the rear will be slightly unsettled, also as the car rolls leaning away from the corner causing a roll.

With cars If the axis of rotation is behind the centre of the car, the car will understeer. If its in front of the centre of the car, then the car will oversteer.

Oversteer (which you are getting) usually means you unsettled the car mid corner, the only way you can get around the corner smoothly is by keeping the car balanced mid corner which is the key to driving fast and cleanly! When the car is balanced mid corner, it's not over rotating or under rotating and points just where you want it to go!

Don’t go throwing parts at it as you’ll be throwing money away mate
Excellent advice Agreed, don't go throwing parts at the car.

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
 

carl hammond

Advanced Member
Messages
3,737
Thanks for the replies
Yeah think I’ll probs get a frsu geo done when iv got time and take it a bit easier in the wet trying not to unbalance it as much haha, car is good in the dry
And yeah at the end of the session was fun playing with the liftoff oversteer


View attachment 7406
Not sure why people call it a FRSU tbh, no such thing really exists. All it is is a more aggressive geo which generally only adds some additional camber where supporting changes are made to the car, 90% wont run more caster or additional toe in/out as they use the cars on the road more than track.

Have a look through my suspension guide for setups I have personally tried and tested on both the road and track, see if any are similar to your car (as in coilovers or damper and spring combo and then if you need or want any additional info just ask as I have tried all kinds of geo's on mind so I can help by letting you know what the car did and how it handled with certain levels of camber and toe etc. One thing to remember is that everyone wants different characteristics from their car, so what works for one wont be what someone else wants from it and they may then feel the cars pants or handling wrong etc. Also a track setup wont be nice on the road 90% of the time, mines setup specifically for track with full corner weighting etc and is a bit interesting on the road now, if its a flat smooth road it's great, on a bumpy or poor surface I really notice it.

Pm me if you want to discuss anything geo wise as one of my best mates used to setup cars for all race leagues (even an Formular racing teams) so I have tried and tested many with his help and advice so can give you an idea of what may work for your needs.

Carl

PS - Love the clips, I would be keeping it like that for the fun factor if nothing else lol
 
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carl hammond

Advanced Member
Messages
3,737
Curious, what is FRSU?
FRSU, is what people class as a "fast road set up" mate, basically a slightly adjusted geo from stock (e.g. a little more camber etc) which is why I said there is no such thing as a FRSU, it's just people trying to make a slightly more aggressive geo sound special lol
 

Lemons

Advanced Member
Messages
372
Not quite the same but my rear end was feeling unstable, accelerating up a hill on fast swooping bend I regularly take. Hardrace arb bushes cured this, I couldn't believe the difference they made. It might be worth a try as it's sub £25 if you haven't changed them in your ownership.
 

JustinEET

Advanced Member
Messages
108
FRSU, is what people class as a "fast road set up" mate, basically a slightly adjusted geo from stock (e.g. a little more camber etc) which is why I said there is no such thing as a FRSU, it's just people trying to make a slightly more aggressive geo sound special lol
Oh lol, I've never heard that before. Must be something they say over there.
 

SamDC5

Advanced Member
Messages
1,433
Went on a wet track day and back of the car felt very tail happy,
Understand weather conditions were not great but chasing other ep3s and watching them stay in a straight line felt like something isn’t right here
Any suggestions
Would better rear arb and bushes help ? Thanks
Makes for a cool gif though haha View attachment 7403
What tyres were you using and what pressures?

Wet driving is all about getting heat into the tyres along with having a stable setup for the car.

The geometry information would be vital here too.

But to answer your question, rear ARB bushes probably won't help your cause, don't forget in the rain you want a more stable car anyway so increasing rear stiffness would be a negative effect here. That being said replacing the bushes if they're worn will help all round on car responsiveness.



Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk
 
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SamDC5

Advanced Member
Messages
1,433
I have driven Donington in the pouring rain many times and I'd say my car is fairly stable there.

It doesn't help that the surface of Donington is terrible in the rain, it really makes the car work for grip and its still nice and stable.


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