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[wj51fut]

Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly-- Now FIXED!!!!

Hi,

I am still getting noises from my engine and its been going on for about 2 years!! crazy i know but so far ive had the Lost motion Assemblies Changed by Honda and the Bottom End Bearings done by TGM, both inwhich were reccommended that i have done.

Tom at TGM says that its the bottom end somewhere and Honda reckon its the gearbox or top end?!?

Ive taken off the rocker cover myself the other day and didnt realise that the cam system was a roller bearing system (on the H22a i had it was a solid system)

Has anybody had any problems with these roller bearing arms or a really noisy tappet or two?

The noise is driving me nuts and has cost me a fortune so far!!

Adam

So it turned out to be the VTC actuator. Got the cam out today and took it down a local garage to use there air gun on it as it was too tight to do it by hand. The tappets need re-doing on the inlet side but i will do that when it is stone cold and when i get my new cam cover through.

 

[VT-Doo]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

You'll need to take a video of the engine while it's running. Make sure you cover all area under the bonnet. Only then can a proper assumption be made.


When does the sound occur? Does it go away?

 

[wj51fut]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

But surely oil would go everywhere???

The noise got worse when i put slick 50 in the petrol system and one for the engine itself. Honda re-done the tappets as they had 'moved'.

But im still unconvinced that they've done a good job.

The noise sometimes happens on start up then after a second it goes, sounds like a lack of oil.

The noise never goes away but is more pronounced between 2.5k and 3k under light throttle which makes me think its something loose or not adjusted right.

 

[C&S Evo7]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

as im sure you can appreciate its pretty difficult to diagnose that kind of fault over the net, but knowing Tom as well as i do, i would go with his opinion, he probably has more experience with the dc5 than any other person in Europe,

In the nicest possible way , if its been to Honda and to TGM, i dont now what you expect to find out from a forum, except lots of different guesses as to what could be wrong, more than likely confusing the matter.

I know this isnt what you want to hear , i'm just trying to be realistic and save you more grief. its not an attack on the knowlagable guys on here or anything like that, im pretty sure if Tom thought it was a loose rocker he would have told you that and fixed it there and then

if it bothered me that much then the motor would be out and in bits on my bench i dont see any other real solution other than a total tear down.

sorry.

 

[wj51fut]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

I wish I could tear it down myself! But I don't have the resources or the know how to be confident to do it. Tom said it would be about £1k to do it too. And even then he said that he might not find the problem.

Could be stuck with it...

 

[C&S Evo7]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

do you need to use the car as a daily driver?

 

[VT-Doo]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

But surely oil would go everywhere???

I'm only asking you to open the bonnet and and make a video from different aspects of the engine while it's running.

As has already been said, I think you could be grabbing at straws seeing as you've already had two professionals look over it.

None the less I'm curious to hear it.

 

[wj51fut]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

Yes I do use it as a daily driver but can do without it for a short while like one week if need be.

I just know it's going to be something simple! Always is!

Will do a video tonight.

 

[wj51fut]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

Ok the videos are downloading now.

The first one is from start up, Second is what you can hear from within the car and the Third one is when the car is really warm (quick blitz up the road)

You can hear it in ALL Three videos, its just very feint.

Adam

 

[wj51fut]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOaPTiu6DrQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=voocihKjER0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gu0DnQPvA2g

 

[VT-Doo]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

That's got me baffled :xconfused:


Has the top end been fully inspected?
It sounds like my Mini did before I adjusted the tappets...was it done when the engine was stone cold?

Can you feel any vibrations if you touch the engine?

Is the chain tensioner ok?

What oil are you using?

 

[wj51fut]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

It does sound like my old mini too!!

Honda replaced the lost motion assemblies but they said that they didnt inspect or measure anything when the car was in bits.

It made a hell of a difference when they did do the tappets but to be honest i cannot remember how 'dull' the noise went.

Im not entirely sure weather they done it from stone cold either, my guess is no.

 

[wj51fut]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

No vibrations, checked the covers and heat sheilds. Cant feel anything through the rocker cover either but in my opinion its coming from the top end.

Oil is whatever Tom @ TGM used! 5w40 i use.

Chain tensioner was replaced by Honda when the LMA's were done (about 8 months ago)

 

[VT-Doo]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

Oh that's a toughy, especially without seeing the car :?

Does the noise get louder if you remove the oil cap?

Personally I'd start by checking the tappets. I know you say it's been done, but you never know, it might not have been done properly.

 

[wj51fut]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

Well thats confirmed it!!

Thankyou thankyou thankyou VT-Doo!!

I dont know why i didnt do it before, i started the car up, let it down to idle and opened the oil filler cap.
Didnt realise it would sound like a blown exhaust! But as i was lightly throttling the car i could see the cams going around and EVERYTIME the cam came down on the tappet the noise was there! Confirming that its something to do with the top end, maybe tappets. Will investigate more myself on Monday to see what i can see.

 

[12T]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

Hey i have the exact same noise in my car! Soon as i heard this noise i stopped driving it completely and put it off road. My bro is a mechanic and have a lil experience with k20's so my car is being stripped down soon to have a look.

He thinks its the timing chain that is loose or the chain tensioner, i have a toda tensioner put in a couple of years back so its a small chance it will be that.
But what ever you do dont drive your car or you might cause more problems ie valves touching!
I will keep you updated of what the problem is and if there is any other damage done to the engine. My engine will be getting stripped in a few weeks time as he is rebuilding a blown Zafira Gsi engine.

PM me if you want my bro to take a look at your engine after mine is done.

Russ

 

[VT-Doo]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

wj51fut,

I've listened to your first video 4 times now; When you put the camera down the side of the timing chain/abs the engine sounds fine to me. Again, when it's down the back it also sounds not too bad.
The bulk of the noise seems to be coming from the front...

I'm thinking it could be your injectors. Put Redex in the fuel tank with fresh V-Power. If the sound gets quieter then you could be onto a winner.

Also double check your valve lash when the engine is stone cold.

What's the mileage of your car and what petrol do you use?

 

[12T]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

wj51fut,

I've listened to your first video 4 times now; When you put the camera down the side of the timing chain/abs the engine sounds fine to me. Again, when it's down the back it also sounds not too bad.
The bulk of the noise seems to be coming from the front...

I'm thinking it could be your injectors. Put Redex in the fuel tank with fresh V-Power. If the sound gets quieter then you could be onto a winner.

Also double check your valve lash when the engine is stone cold.

What's the mileage of your car and what petrol do you use?

Also take off your cam cover and check your chain to see if its loose? I have the exact same noise in my car, my bro narrowed the fault down to the chain or tensioner. If you listen carefully to the left side of your engine the tapping noise is loud when reving up and down.

HTH

Russ

 

[VT-Doo]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

If you listen carefully to the left side of your engine the tapping noise is loud when reving up and down.

IMO it's not.

 

[12T]

Re: Tappets or Rocker/Roller assembly

Well his car does sound identical to mine in the 3 videos that he posted, you have to be there to really hear the engine. Its a loud dut dut dut dut dut dut...... noise which you can hear even in the car.

VT doo the videos dont do it justice