Mugen N1 Test drive.

jonster

Advanced Member
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866
I was lucky enough to meet Tom at T&G Autos / TGMsport in Fleet on Saturday. What a top chap! He was kind enough to lend me a Mugen N1 ECU to test drive while I was there. I ripped off the glove box and footwell trim within minutes, pulled out my Honda mapped ECU and popped-in the Mugen.

I cranked the motor and it started first time. Out on the road I immediated noticed the it seemed to have slightly less torque than the Hondata map at low speed 2nd or 3rd gear. The thing that really impressed was the smooth VTEC transition (starting at 5250 rpm). It's completely smooth with no bog-down what so ever. My Hondata map has always suffered a power drop between 5k (VTEC point) which recovers by 6k. This has always really annoyed me and I was told by Doug that this is due to me needing a decent CAI. I've previously ran with a stock airbox with a Spoon drop-in and bored TB and this had no real change on the bog-down problem from when I just ran a stock intake and TB. I've recently added a GruppeM so combined with the bored TB it doesn't get much better than that. The problem remains. I can only assume I've got an early Hondata map and hope that there is a new map out there that solves this problem. Roll on K Pro purchase.

The other notable thing about driving with the Mugen is the fast rev build-up post VTEC kick-in. This translates to a slight harder high rev pull, but this is not significantly better than the Hondata.

The experience left me thinking I would like this ECU because I know a lot of time has gone in to it and it drives faultlessly. I don't know about it's fuel economy but otherwise I like it. If I could have the Hondata low-end torque, the Mugen smooth VTEC cross-over and top-end power I'd be very happy. I guess the K Pro will give me this eventually, but the Mugen is already pretty sorted now.

Franz came out with me as a passenger on both Mugen and Hondata runs so he might want to add his view to the experience too.

Thanks again to Tom for the loan.

Jon
 

jonster

Advanced Member
Messages
866
Mark,

If your engine makes it past Goodwood on Saturday I'll give the K Pro some serious thought :)

I've managed to zero my back account over the last few weeks of mod frenzy so I need to chill for a month. The missus is also making me spend it all on the bloody garden at the moment. It's so unfair !

See you at the Saturday show down :twisted:

Jon
 

MJ Type-R

Advanced member
Messages
1,578
Jon, Also remember the Mugen ECU disables a lot of the engine check codes, so you would never be sure the car is running as intended :!:

The advantage of the K-Pro, you can disable what you want, i.e. second O2 sensor :idea:

Mike
 

jonster

Advanced Member
Messages
866
Yeah, I know this. I've been studying the K Pro progress closely. I'd love to try the most current Hondat K20A map to see if this cures the bog-down problem. It would be nice to have a Mugen base map to play with too. It's all a matter of time I guess.

Have you got any mods left to do on yours now? :)

Hope to see you at the track soon mate.

Jon
 

MJ Type-R

Advanced member
Messages
1,578
Hi Jon

2 Left to do for the time being, then save some money and start paying off my mortgage :oops:

1 - Replace the standard clutch with an Exedy organic one (my gear box sychro's are being replaced under warranty, so may as well do the clutch at the same time :idea: )

2 - Get the car tuned.

As to track, that will come in time :!:

Mike
 

Unnamed_warrior

Advanced Member
Messages
630
jonster said:
Mark,

If your engine makes it past Goodwood on Saturday I'll give the K Pro some serious thought :)

Jon
What you trying to say mate, that the K20 Pro will blow up my engine... Nah I think you got more chance of the Mugen doing that..

UW
 

jonster

Advanced Member
Messages
866
Just pulling yer leg, Mark. I've got to talk myself out of buying one for at least a month.

Jon
 

ps2london

Advanced Member
Messages
260
blow up engine???? heh come on! Honda engines are so well make right?

i don't know anything about K-Pro, but i think mugen ECU is very good for the people like me, LAZY! remove the orginal one. put in the orginal one. 5 mins job.

just in my option, maybe Mugen N1 is not the best ECU, but at least u won't go wrong with them, lots of people running Mugen N1 ECU for racing in Asia, and they win the race. Mugen said, with Mugen N1 ECU+ mugen Airbox + N1 Exhaust, u will have xx bhp increase, but i forgot how many....., plus no need to mapping, leave the car to people overnight, perfect for me, and is stand alone ECU aswell. u can borrow to people or sell it .... keep the value. No mugen ECU for uk EP3, they must go for K Pro.

John
about the less torque, i am not too sure yet until i try it myself tomorrow, but i agree with u for the high ravs, becuase "Not for public road use" in jap written on the ECU.

but anyway, they have Mugen 8600rpm version ECU for sell, i think that will suit for normal road use.

Mark
i will put my foot down on Sat, yeah yeah, i know u will :lol: hope both of us back home safe.

K Pro and mugen, i think they both do the same job. but i won't think they will blow the engine, both still under Group N. question, for Mike's car, turbo charge, is he still under Group N, can people bring turbo charge DC5 to race Group N DC5?

correct me if i am wrong.
 

20Drift

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Staff member
Messages
289
kpro? something like M$ 2000 Pro that will be released the SP in later time but not providing a free download? if so, then i think should wait for the 2005 version release. =) or get a mugen & do it rite in first time? i think 99% of people don’t have any ideas of what kpro is in japan or hongkong. even those people taking their cars to race in macau… I asked my friend in us but he don’t have any clues as well… maybe he’s not a big Honda fan as he only got a Honda Integra but not a “Type R”. just my thought, is that really useful to custom map the ecu if just for an air filter & exhaust system? or, treats it like a v-tec controller for street use and used to reduce the time in 0-60 at traffic light? if I remember, Mugen claimed around 35hp with their air filter, exhaust system and the ecu. so, the car should running 250hp+? i got a magazine that someone tried on his DC5-R and done the RR in hongkong… maybe mugen is just a big name? anyway, just my opinion. :xhappy:
 

Type R - Matt

Advanced Member
Messages
216
Do Apexi not sell an Power FC for the DC5 yet?

IMHO you are better off buying an ECU from a big company like Apexi, HKS, that is programable with a standard modded map on to start with, the Honda engines are strong, but an incorrect map and bang :( Atleast the big manufacturers will have done extensive testing.

Some on the board are proberly not as knowledgable as some others, and I can't stress enough that fidling with a map on a complex engine like the K20a, can result in tears, and can quite often make it worse to drive.

What one person thinks is good, others will find fault, just be careful chaps.
 

Trung

Advanced Member
Messages
597
Type R - Matt said:
Do Apexi not sell an Power FC for the DC5 yet?

IMHO you are better off buying an ECU from a big company like Apexi, HKS, that is programable with a standard modded map on to start with, the Honda engines are strong, but an incorrect map and bang :( Atleast the big manufacturers will have done extensive testing.
No APEXi Power FC for K20a.
Also the HKS ECU is crap.
 

Type R - Matt

Advanced Member
Messages
216
Define crap?

What is specifically wrong with the F-Con?

I don't spend any time researching mods for the K20a so not completely upto speed what is on offer, I think that bolting on an ECU, and remaping with out careful research can go tits up, and would be happier sticking with a bigger brand. Im not a fan of the American stuff, as generally they are working with the lower output K20.
 

Trung

Advanced Member
Messages
597
I will explain about the HKS F-Con later. I've just headache at the moment.

I too stick with big brands (as you can see in my sig) but sometimes they dont' always offer the best.
Hondata is NOT an inferior brand. They have spent many years R&D all their ECU programs and maps. They work with top race teams throughout the world and tuners. THey have researched on ALL K20a engines.
Toda enginekit and Skunk2 work with Hondata for their ECU program.

As regarding to Andre's comment.
Hondata cannot be compared to Mugen ECU, its completely different.
K-Pro is fully remappable ECU. Tuned to your specs a bit like Unichip but more advanced. For existing Hondata flashed ECU owners such as Jon, they can uprade to K-Pro with a discounted price. It has a host of features including datalogging. You can even replicate Mugen maps into it.
http://www.hondata.com/kprorelease.html
 
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