Spoon 2-1 and 4-2 or Buddyclub mani?

[NAS]

Ok so at the moment:

BC>Spoon
Toda>BC

I know TODA is meant to be the best but i simply cant warrant the extra £££ for a couple of horses. So over all it would be a good move to go all BC then. Sounds good to me. Thanks for your input. Any more info would be great.

Lets solve a mystery...

ON THE DYNO
BC - DC - TODA give great torque and power at midrange. Around 20-25HP maybe more :shock: than Spoon does!!!
Toda and BC give the most midrange power and torque than ALL the other (including Js,DC and of course spoon mani)
BUT, top end power Spoon is slightly better than BC and Toda and DC and J's...

ON THE ROAD (when racing another DC5 or EP3)
ALL manifolds do the same job. Spoon - BC - TODA - DC ARE EQUAL! :!:
(meaning you are always 7000-9000rpm)

To be honest I have the same dillema as you...
I have a full spoon exhaust with CAI and K-pro.
On the dyno midrange is sh#t compared to other setups. Especially Toda or BC. :roll:

Another thing you must know is that with spoon mani v-tec point CAN'T go below 5200... With BC and Toda can be easily go at 4500 or 4300 depends on the programmer. This is a big difference.
Also torque curve with spoon manifold is completely different. Other setups have peak torque 1000rpm after v-teckin (5500-6000) and spoon has at 7000!!! Peak power with spoon manifold comes at above 8000 and other setups 7500 or 7800
In other words it seems that BC and Toda have the most "driveable" combination.
I want to try the Toda mani. I guess that in real life situations (and not racing ) like cruising with 6th gear and 3000rpm and floor it, Toda and BC will react immediatelly. With spoon you must put 5th or 4th gear :lol: to catch them...

 

[MrHanky]

Sorry to throw this in the mix but im just looking at options for the future. How does the Mugen manifold with sports cat compare to the competition?

Thanks

Mark

 

[raz786]

how much hp would you expect as a gyesstimate from all the above mentioned manifolds alone?

 

[Project]

In my eyes Spoon is crap when it comes to manifolds, the joins arent flat, the resonator shouldnt even be there as there is no purpose for it other than making it sound ricey, and the flexipipe isnt the best and can split, and the welds are a joke. If you got a chance to change then I would say go for it, the buddy club is a great manifold as it ticks the most amount of boxes, welds are good, finish is good, performance is good, price is good. Toda is slightly better but unless your a hardcore tracker, on the road you wont see a difference.
If anyone is worried about the CAT come MOT time then the mugen is the only option worth thinking about, saves hours of swapping time, and will perform miles better than the Spoon; only thing is the silly price tag.

 

[MilanoChris]

how much hp would you expect as a gyesstimate from all the above mentioned manifolds alone?

Alone with no other mods? Probably negligible mate. You really need induction, KPro and exhaust to get the best from a manifold.

It's like putting on a massive turbo with standard fuel rail.

 

[raz786]

minus the kpro chris, and what kind of figures? KPro is on my shopping list but not yet...

 

[MilanoChris]

Save and get KPro and mani at the same time. Mani won't give you much without it mate, plus there's the running lean issue.

 

[Glitch]

Well my VTEC point is currently 4500 and I have the spoon and it goes like a rocket so ive had no problems there.

I know what you mean about the quality of the Spoon, its not great. Im pritty sure BC is the way for me.

 

[spo_gen]

Sorry to throw this in the mix but im just looking at options for the future. How does the Mugen manifold with sports cat compare to the competition?

Thanks

Mark

The Mugen is very good against OEM. But any sport CAT mani will not be as good as a race mani.
Another sport CAT mani to consider is the Maxim one. Cheaper and produces just as much gains, if not better. Also, very high build quality too.

 

[MilanoChris]

Plus the same people make them :wink:

 

[MrHanky]

Sorry to throw this in the mix but im just looking at options for the future. How does the Mugen manifold with sports cat compare to the competition?

Thanks

Mark

The Mugen is very good against OEM. But any sport CAT mani will not be as good as a race mani.
Another sport CAT mani to consider is the Maxim one. Cheaper and produces just as much gains, if not better. Also, very high build quality too.

Thanks for the information. My brother is currently telling me to ignore th Mugen one and go for something like the BC or Toda. How much of a pain is it come MOT time? an hour or 2 to put the cat back on etc?

Thanks

Mark

 

[MilanoChris]

The main pain aside from the time required is the bolts, but if you use copper grease on them it will be easier next year.

You'll need a ramp as doing it on axle stands would take far far longer.

You'll have to loosen the sway bar and move it (otherwise the mani won't come out), the two O2 sensors, the bolts onto the b-pipe and the bolts onto the head. Most can be done from under the car, but the bolts on the head can be a pain to get to.

 

[NAS]

Has anyone tried spoon N1 - spoon b pipe and BC header??
Will they fit together?? Any modifications required?

This week I'll change the spoon manifold with the BC. The rest of the exhaust will remain the same - spoon b pipe and n1.
Other specs of the car are Injen CAI, Spoon TB and K-pro.

I made some runs with racelogic's performance box. Especially roll on from 60 to 180 or 200 km/h with my curent setup to see what the gains will be.

I have several RR data with the spoon theme and I am expecting a
HUGE improvement at midrange. But what about low and high rpms?
I was also wondering about the quality of BC header. Is it ok or will it crack? I have Energy suspension insert mounts and J's racing ETD.
What do you guys think?

Thanks
Mike

 

[MilanoChris]

To get the most you'll need a tweak of your KPro map. If your current map was done well then there'll be a danger of you running lean as the BC mani flows much better then the Spoon. Datalog before and after to see what you AF ratio is like and to see if there's any problems with knocking.