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Similar to toda profile I believe. Probably expect to see 10hp top end and generally good gains across the range especially with you having the 3"
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The most NA power achievable?
- Thread starter truupR
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Crazylegs
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Why don't you email Neil Brown engineering, see how much it would cost for a fully built K20.
http://www.nbe.co.uk/
http://www.nbe.co.uk/
Crazylegs
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hondamad2204
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Gordon is your man to talk to. He's got his to 300 bhp na. and hes on the forum, ....suppressed he's not commented as yet. But he does have a build thread. 
integraleo
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This is why I opted for supercharger. Cost for gains become huge when sticking to na. Example above is 1500 quid for 10hp. Is that value for money? I gained 10hp with a 3" exhaust that cost £550 but sold it after 6 weeks because I couldn't stand the drone. To put £ per hp in perspective my supercharger cost me £4000 all in...that's jrsc (second hand) charge cooler, pulleys,injectors, fitting and mapping. For that money I gained 82 hp above and beyond what I already had na with k100 to give me 308hp. Ok it's not na but if it wasn't for the whine of the charger you wouldn't know it wasn't a high power na car, it drives exactly the same as na low down and the power increases with the revs and all the power is still at top end so screaming it is still the fastest way of driving it. Throttle response is instant,mid corner throttle adjustment is the same as it was before but with a flat line torque curve from 4500-8000 rpm so midrange is improved and smoothed out. Depends what your ultimate goal is of course but if you want a safe reliable 300hp on a k20 supercharging is hard to ignore. it would give you great jdm points to tell everyone it's still NA...but how much is that worth to you?
truupR
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Some interesting reads so far.
Couldn't agree with you more Leo about boost being a much more financially sound option. The gains per £ are much much bigger, and it doesn't become a total pig to drive as a daily.
I had to ask the question though because beyond the usual mods I mentioned in my first post - nobody really talks about NA tuning.
I'm certainly not wanting to keep if NA for 'mad jdm points yo'. I genuinely curious to know was there a way to keep it NA, get some good gains (closer to 300 horses) whilst keeping the cost on the sensible side of say 6k to 8k which is roughly the cost to supercharge/turbo
I can't comment on a supercharged k20, I've never driven one but it does seem closer to NA than a turbo setup. I've had the pleasure of driving a turbo'd integra several times and whilst the power is crazy addictive - it didn't feel like a teg anymore. It'd lost that bit of Honda charm and not something I could see myself wanting to drive every day. That's my own personal opinion though..
Supercharging has been on the cards for quite some time and, most probably it'll be the route I take.. In the mean time I'm going to go have a gander at Gordon's build thread
Couldn't agree with you more Leo about boost being a much more financially sound option. The gains per £ are much much bigger, and it doesn't become a total pig to drive as a daily.
I had to ask the question though because beyond the usual mods I mentioned in my first post - nobody really talks about NA tuning.
I'm certainly not wanting to keep if NA for 'mad jdm points yo'. I genuinely curious to know was there a way to keep it NA, get some good gains (closer to 300 horses) whilst keeping the cost on the sensible side of say 6k to 8k which is roughly the cost to supercharge/turbo
I can't comment on a supercharged k20, I've never driven one but it does seem closer to NA than a turbo setup. I've had the pleasure of driving a turbo'd integra several times and whilst the power is crazy addictive - it didn't feel like a teg anymore. It'd lost that bit of Honda charm and not something I could see myself wanting to drive every day. That's my own personal opinion though..
Supercharging has been on the cards for quite some time and, most probably it'll be the route I take.. In the mean time I'm going to go have a gander at Gordon's build thread
integraleo
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Completely understand about the turbo route, I used to own a 320hp dc2 which was insanely fast but as you say lost the feel of the car. Supercharging is completely different as it maintains the engines character, to be honest below 4000rpm you would be hard pushed to tell the difference.
MrRy
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Hmm if anything, boosting my DC2 made it feel even more special and more importantly, fun.
Boost has been the future for quite some time. I don't fully understand why people want to obtain such peak power in N/A form for an already fun N/A car because in my experience, over the past 15 years people on forums that have high power N/A or turbo cars chase a number, and even if they get there, they often regret the money and more importantly time, they spent (especially once they sell up) and they all seem to come to the realisation that cost and extra maintenance outweighs the fun factor
What I'm getting at is, an additional peak 50bhp soon feels "normal" but you do not need to spend that much money to get the characteristics that come with higher power modifications, because that's really where the fun lies - well, for me at least. I miss high compression + boost personally. The torque pull with the turbo kicking in from 3k then Vtec kicking in shortly after, then screaming to 9k and then finally hearing that turbo chatter is immense, there is nothing like it. If I had a turbo kit on the 5 and it didn't produce anymore than 250bhp "peak", I wouldn't care because I would have what I wanted. The feeling and characteristic, not the numbers that all these traders and parts makers sell to us as the holy grail. Each to their own, but chasing a power figure is not what these cars are about, Adding fun is my path, not bhp or torque, that's just the by-product that sometimes comes with a modification.
Boost has been the future for quite some time. I don't fully understand why people want to obtain such peak power in N/A form for an already fun N/A car because in my experience, over the past 15 years people on forums that have high power N/A or turbo cars chase a number, and even if they get there, they often regret the money and more importantly time, they spent (especially once they sell up) and they all seem to come to the realisation that cost and extra maintenance outweighs the fun factor
What I'm getting at is, an additional peak 50bhp soon feels "normal" but you do not need to spend that much money to get the characteristics that come with higher power modifications, because that's really where the fun lies - well, for me at least. I miss high compression + boost personally. The torque pull with the turbo kicking in from 3k then Vtec kicking in shortly after, then screaming to 9k and then finally hearing that turbo chatter is immense, there is nothing like it. If I had a turbo kit on the 5 and it didn't produce anymore than 250bhp "peak", I wouldn't care because I would have what I wanted. The feeling and characteristic, not the numbers that all these traders and parts makers sell to us as the holy grail. Each to their own, but chasing a power figure is not what these cars are about, Adding fun is my path, not bhp or torque, that's just the by-product that sometimes comes with a modification.
integraleo
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My turbo dc2 was the most fun I've ever had in a car and miss it daily but it did undoubtedly affect its handling characteristics in a negative way. Was huge huge fun with bov and screamer pipe and buddyclub spec 2 exhaust it could be heard for miles and was intoxicating. However I bought my dc2s and dc5s primarily for thier handling and poise on the road. Would I own a turbo dc5??? Simple answer yes in a Heartbeat but would I lose something else.....probably. At the moment supercharger has given me a mix of the best of both worlds. Relatively high power without any moderation to the handling and still reliable without over stressing anything. I'll admit I still want more power and that will be sorted soon but as a package it's hard to beat
MrRy
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I can't argue with that. The DC2 chassis was just never meant for high torque input. I also felt like it lost some of its best handling characteristics and it turned the car into something I just wasn't experienced enough to drive as it was too much to handle on the road. The DC5 though, the jury is out. Never experienced higher torque inputs in a 5 before.
I can't discredit supercharging as I have little real world experience with it and everyone seems to love their supercharged 5's which can only be a good sign, I just have a lust for overly loud chatter and like that with a normal-sized exhaust, turbo installations are so quiet and stealthy.
I can't discredit supercharging as I have little real world experience with it and everyone seems to love their supercharged 5's which can only be a good sign, I just have a lust for overly loud chatter and like that with a normal-sized exhaust, turbo installations are so quiet and stealthy.
beppe786
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We have just imported a 135i there twin turbos excally like you said patch high and low power..
Yes crazylegs small turbo will kick in faster and run out puff near redline..
Mine pulls from 4000 then 5000 in high cam onwards redline goes crazy.. need a shift light as keep hitting the limiter and k20 valves dont like that..
Yes crazylegs small turbo will kick in faster and run out puff near redline..
Mine pulls from 4000 then 5000 in high cam onwards redline goes crazy.. need a shift light as keep hitting the limiter and k20 valves dont like that..
