Help me justify £4.5k engine build

[tricker_luke]

After burning a nice hole through piston number 1 (pic at end) and scoring/ damaging the cylinder, I stripped the engine out and took the bits to Ian at Clockwise Motion in Bromsgrove.

I have various options available, and I can exchange my block for another standard block with bore/hone, or exchange it for a block that has Darton MID sleeves and overbore to my specification. I would probably go 89 or 89.5mm to give 2.14L or 2.164L

So, onto the pricing. Someone help me justify doing this list, and it will be an almost new engine. Obviously other options include buying a used engine but always a risk.

Darton block
Cosworth high comp forged pistons
ACL race bearings
Crank micro polish
Conrod hone (If using standard conrods to fit forged pistons)
Forged conrods (possibly)
Conrod bolts
Block deck
Bottom gasket set
Oil pump
Oil pump chain set
Sump baffle
Engine balance
Block build labour

Head rebuild (stems, guides, 3 angle seat, new valves, labour)

Head gasket
Timing chain
Tensioner
Chain guides
Head bolts
Full gasket set
Running in oil and filter
Lightened 2.9kg flywheel

 

[blueguy]

If I was in your position this is the most likely direction I would take or a K24 conversion. In saying that though, I decided long ago that I would keep the teg forever which is a big decision factor IMO.

 

[lee76]

I have just got the full race version of this engine (2140cc) from Ian and his quality of work is second to none I would not trust any one else with my engine.
Seen loads of engines from other well known companies that have suffered problems. And as you say it is a new engine not second hand which could last for ages or be a time bomb.

 

[Mark_teg]

Are forged con-rods really needed?

Apart from that, go for it!
At the end of the day it's only money, it's there for spending, can't take it with you, etc.

I'm assuming you haven't got a family to support?..

If you dont have any commitments (house, etc), shame on you for even asking :twisted: :xyes:

Also, you have to do something as the car is of no use in it's current state!

HTH

 

[coyote_dc5]

nice shopping list! as mark_teg says, no commitments, then no brainer!!

Did you find out how you blew that cylinder in the end?

 

[tricker_luke]

I looked at the K24 option, but safe rev limit is 7k. Yuo can take it higher with forged pistons/ conrods etc but at 7k the pistons are already travelling the speed of the K20 at 9k...

I spent 3 hours at Ians workshop the other week, he explained everything and has all the machinery to do the job. Seems like a very knowledgable guy and trustworthy.

Exactly my thoughts on the conrods, and Ian mentioned I probably wouldn't need them. Should they still be ok if they are straight? The engine had done 85k miles.

No family comittments, just me myself and I :wink:

 

[coyote_dc5]

Good man, we'll look forward to the project thread :xlol: :xcheers:

 

[Mark_teg]

Good man, we'll look forward to the project thread \/ :xlol:

Indeed \/

 

[tricker_luke]

I've got about 100 pics of the strip down so far Probably worth throwing them into a thread with a bit of a write up. I'm also taking care of any rusty bits too, I gave the subframe a nice de-rust and black hammerite coating, next is the engine bay.

It's proving a little hard to find the cause of the problem. Obviously it could be down to various things. Ian suggested possibly too advanced ignition, or a fuel problem such as the pump or filter.

I can do a pressure test on the fuel rail to check the pressure. Does the pressure stay constant even at high revs, and the injectors activate faster, or does the pressure actually increase? I think I recall only one specification value in the manual.

I also had the injectors sent off and they came back with only 1.25% variation between them, and that's after up to 10 years without a clean! They are now all flowing at the full 330, but also proved that the injector was not to blame.

 

[coyote_dc5]

Fuel injector/rail clean replacement is an interesting point. Is it in the service interval to do such work or should it last the life of the car? If a fuel problem can cause such devastating results then maybe we should be performing more frequent maintenance on it.

I've never touched mine in 150k+ miles :-"

 

[tricker_luke]

Just checked and the injectors aren't part of the maintenance. The fuel filter isn't even on there either though. I'd say it's worth having the injectors done maybe every 40,000 miles or so, apparently it can make a good difference.

The injector clean cost me £60, that was through an Ebay company and they replace all the rubber o rings etc too.

I'm going to replace my fuel filter at the minimum, and also have the map checked/ changed if the engine spec is going to change.

 

[Vtec Accord]

I take it you already have a built head (cams, springs etc) and engine management to go with this built engine?

If not I would take the opportunity to add those to the mix as well.

Ian has built some fantastic Honda race engines and has a great reputation.

:0

 

[tricker_luke]

I've got Kpro, and the full "bolt on" mods, but have not uprated the head.

I'm having the head rebuilt, using new valves, guides and stems, but the components will be staying oem for the time being.

Ian claims that a 2188cc (90mm bore) with high compression pistons will give 27hp increase, but I will probably go for 89mm so there is a safety margin, since 90mm is the max.

My car made 212 wheel HP on the dyno, maybe 240/250 at fly? I think this engine might be able to push 260/270, or is that being optimistic?

Combine that with the 2.9kg flywheel, when standard is 4.75kg, and it will rev up quicker too.

 

[C&S Evo7]

are you going to go racing?

 

[Vtec Accord]

If I was you I would get cams at same time then its all done and you only have to pay for the build and mapping once... You'll kick yourself if 6months or so down the line you decide you want to upgrade the cams.

You don't even have to go too agreesive on the cams, for what they cost I think it would be shame to have a fully built block capable of hadnling well over 300hp with a stock head...

Just my 2ps worth.



Oh i'd get the forged rods, no point having one weaker link in a build like this...

 

[tricker_luke]

Was that aimed at the flywheel, or the power increase?

People need to stop putting ideas into my head because I'm terrible when it comes to decisions, and just adding that extra bit or two...

 

[donkeykong]

well like i said before, u really have bad luck, rebuild would be best yeah since ur engine is new then

 

[Grov]

If you got nothing else than kids or house, etc, then go for it mate, though it's a lot of cash, can you not salvage what you have to a buy a new one? Just a thought, all your mods, etc would make a fair bit, no idea just guessing to be honest.

Although a 270-280bhp N/A DC5 would be quite nice. :twisted:

 

[tricker_luke]

If you got nothing else than kids or house, etc, then go for it mate, though it's a lot of cash, can you not salvage what you have to a buy a new one? Just a thought, all your mods, etc would make a fair bit, no idea just guessing to be honest.

Although a 270-280bhp N/A DC5 would be quite nice. :twisted:

It would just be the built block and head, so I'd still need my other mods.

Could any engine bits be sold on? Though I doubt anyone would buy chains, tensioner, guides etc. Most of that would prob be scrapped.
The flywheel could be worth something though, and maybe the conrods too if in good condition.

 

[eXceed]

You can buy built engines brand new for that price! But none the less that is a curse goood list and that pic looks the sex! In the end it's up to you. Will be mental!!
Would hope that you'd be putting out more than 270-280bhp with spending £4000 though!!!