Please be careful if tracking...

DC5RK20A

Advanced Member
Messages
179
Finally getting around to posting about my problem. My last gymkana event on the 30th of December I blew the motor. Somewhat, it didn't actually blow, but I lost cyliner 2 and 3's rod bearings. The cause of this is pulling excessive g forces and the oil being thrown against the wall of the oil pan starving 2 & 3 of oil. I stopped for the day after my 4th run because the car was making a horrible noise when revved. I was able to drive it home about 30miles slowly and just parked it until Honda reopened due to the new years. I was actually with a bunch of Honda mechanics at the gymkana. I attempted to drive it to Honda about 9 miles from my place and about half way there the car just died. Called a wrecker truck and had it hauled down.

Honda finally got around to opening it up, dropping the oil pan and checking what was wrong. It was exactly what I told them it was. I still don't know if it is going to be covered under warranty, and I will be a little upset if it is not, as I really didn't do anything wrong. The car afterall is a TYPE R (race) not a TYPE C (cruise) and if Honda would of just installed a baffled oil pan this problem wouldn't of occured. The main problem is that the rod bearings are paper thin, not exactly but they are really thin compared to B series engines.

So I would suggest if you are actually DRIVING your car as it was meant to be driven, invest in a baffled oil pan and save yourself the headache. This has actually happened to quite a few people. It may not be so bad on an actual circuit compared to doing gymkana where the car is tossed around silly, but there really is no point in taking the chance.

Still don't have the car back, have to go to Honda tomorrow as they called me tonight. Hopefully it is going to be good news, but I have a feeling it is going to be, sorry we are not warrantying this. If that is the case, I will never buy another Type R again, because what is the point when Honda went the cheap route and won't cover something that would of cost them an additional maybe 5000yen tops to have baffled the stock oilpan.

Chris
 

Trung

Advanced Member
Messages
597
Sorry to hear about this Chris.
I really do hope Honda will cover you with another engine. :(

Did you use semi or full slick tyres on your Gymkana courses?

Franz and Mark here uses semi slicks many times on trackdays without any problems although on a normal race track you're spending less time throwing the car around corners than on a Gymkana course but the car still can be at a risk. :|
 

jonster

Advanced Member
Messages
866
Very bad luck. There most be some serious cornering on a Gymkana :shock:

I suppose it's an oppotunity to fix TODA internals while the engine is out. 2.2 stroker kit would be cool. Hope your warranty covers things though.

Jon
 

Tarmac

Advanced Member
Messages
759
unlucky for you mate - nasty business. based on your warning though, i've just asked a guy to price some baffled oil pans for me - so thx for that (not that i'll be in a gymkana, but irish roads are crap :lol: )
 

T666YPR

Moderator
Messages
2,102
I guess the warranty might hold up if you were on a track not an off-road course(guessing that's what a gymkhana track is)

I suppose it would be wise to fit a baffled sump just in case.It's got me toying with the idea now :)

Seems you might have had a bit of bad luck with your engine going. :(
 

truffs

member
Messages
1,719
How strange that this subject is brought up. Dan at JAKAN was only warning me about this the other day. The Honda engine on left corning is known to starve itself of engine, however this is on serious hard corners with quite serious g's being inflicted on it. The only way to conquer this is by filling the car to tghe maximum with oil. Chris before you jump down my throat with that comment i now yours would have been without a doubt it was porbably that you were cornign with immense g's. I feel very sorry for you mate, gutted.
:cry:
Im quite lucky because witht he turbo i have an oil well with an extra litre in it, so fingers crossed.......... :roll:
 

truffs

member
Messages
1,719
what a muppet the above is supposed to read starve itself of engine oil :!: muppet :lol:
 

MJ Type-R

Advanced member
Messages
1,578
Sorry to hear this Chris :cry:

Well, I have taken the step anyway, having a baffle sump installed as I type!

Mike
 

Unnamed_warrior

Advanced Member
Messages
630
Unless you are running on sticks, or you are REALLY attacking corners (like in a race or something) I would worry about a baffled sump.. Plus its quite a few hrs labour to fit the damn thing..

Franz and myself have probably done the most trackdays in our DC5's than anyone on here, plus we both run on semi slicks and we have never had a problem..

Just make sure your oil is filled before you go out on your first run and check it again at lunch time..

Don't get me wrong.. if you have the money and want that extra piece of mind then buy one, but you do not need one for trackdays unless you are racing.

Hey Mike how comes you aren't coming to Bedford then.. thought that was your track???

UW
 

DC5RK20A

Advanced Member
Messages
179
I was using street tires actually, Advan AD07s. The only change I made form the last time was installing SWIFT lowering springs. The car was alot more tossable than before, increasing the G load. Yes the oil was full, well with 4.7liters, which is stated as maximum.

The internals would be nice to change, just don't really have the cash at the moment to do it. The Toda rods and pistons would cost about ¥270000. I will have to see, if it is going to be warrantied, then maybe I will find the fundage, but if it is not, no telling how much it is going to cost me. They are also replacing the crankshaft.

Your right about the track events, have to really be attacking the corners hard, which in gymkana that is all you are doing :) It is in the end your choice if you want to or not want to, but if you read this, you have been warned. :D

Take care everyone and enjoy your beasts, hopefully I will have mine back by the first week of February.
 

dan the man

Advanced Member
Messages
3,682
Bad news this, i dont come on the dc5 forum for ages and i read this, what a shame. U had an accident aswell if i remember rightly no? was ages ago when some muppet ran into you...bad luck again.

Whats the score with the b series engine in the dc2? Myself loveing track days when i do go i like to go flat out as i can and with a ring trip everyear id hate it to go pop over in germany :!:

My thoughts are its pretty good as lots of people have had dc2s for years and the problem ha snot surfaced in great detail..?

all the best anywayn and any news??

DAN THE MAN :|
 

DC5RK20A

Advanced Member
Messages
179
No news yet Dan. Thanks. Yeah I haven't had a whole lot of luck. 3 months old, lady decided my car didnt' exist and turned right into me. Tranny broke 2nd gear as I was driving normally and shattered inside the gear casing. Then the engine gave out. Maybe that is everything out of the way and I can enjoy the car till its dying day once I get it back.

The dealer supposedly, finally, yesterday took out the crankshaft to send up to mainland Japan for inspection to verify if I will be paying out my ass or Honda is going to cover it.

The B series engines, well baffled pans are used pretty extensively here in Japan on them as well, but the rod bearings are not as paper thin as they are on the K series. So you have a bit more protection. Here is what I may look into for the baffling of the pan...
BAFFLE

Chris
 

T666YPR

Moderator
Messages
2,102
That's only @ £115 :shock:

Shame they're not sending overseas :(

Some firms are charging for the OEM Honda oilpan with the baffles together,I suppose because they can't exchange the old ones over here.
 

Trung

Advanced Member
Messages
597
Amazing that looks more effective than the Mugen.



I know Prototype Racing also do a baffle as well. B-Factory sells them but its very expensive.

Chris
If you do get that baffle pan. Can you please take some photos of it before and after its welded in your oil pan?

Thanks
 

dan the man

Advanced Member
Messages
3,682
DARN, didnt know about your gear probklem either. Someone new to the car would think they are well unrelaible!! Gone in the mental notes to say the least..lol

good luck anyway.

DTM :!:
 

Trung

Advanced Member
Messages
597
ClubRSX store just startrf to sell Hytech baffled oil sump.


"The pan baffle was designed for road racing. The stock pan does not have anything in it and the oil can go where ever it wants to (not good). The baffle system has five trap doors to contain the oil near the pick up and stops the oil from climbing up the chain."

You can buy it here for $250.00 CRSX Store.
 

Duncs

Moderator
Messages
1,323
whilst i can see and know the benefit of baffled sumps, just a word of warning, the baffle can also restrict the oil returning to the pickup if it is too restrictive, this can also lead to oil starvation.
most motorsport applications also use 'winged sumps' (its that word again wings) to increase the amount of oil in the sump, plus an oil cooler which also increases the amount of oil in the circuit.
so its all in the design :)
 

T666YPR

Moderator
Messages
2,102
This is the Mugen Oil Pan:



Not a lot to it :?

Looks very similar to the one posted above


Cost £245 all in,got held at customs with my other stuff too :evil:

Too much going on in the Club RSX pan for my liking.
 
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