Dyno Charts!!

[VT-Doo]

I mean congrats for the numbers but a regular dc5 in stock form will put between 175 to 185 max at the wheel.. not 205...
was it SAE corrected? and did any other car made a run just to rule out the dyno could be overreading that day...

using a 18% hipotetical loss figure that's like 241.9 BHP in stock form... :shock: [-X

You don't lose a percentage of of power through the drivetrain. By your calculations if a DC5 was running 1000bhp at the flywheel it would lose 180bhp throught the drivetrain...I think not.

Taking (from the graph) 7800 as the point maximum power is made, I calculate the flywheel power to be 223.43bhp.

 

[Armenomania]

You don't lose a percentage of of power through the drivetrain. By your calculations if a DC5 was running 1000bhp at the flywheel it would lose 180bhp throught the drivetrain...I think not.

Taking (from the graph) 7800 as the point maximum power is made, I calculate the flywheel power to be 223.43bhp.

Isnt it the weight that makes the difference? When i went to MOT the car was(waithout taking any unnecessary part from it) 1140KG including the fat Old man inside on the site and everywhere on the internet it says 1180 KG(as stock DC5) :?
any tips how are u calculating the BHP to WHP and WHP-BHP ?

 

[VT-Doo]

You don't lose a percentage of of power through the drivetrain. By your calculations if a DC5 was running 1000bhp at the flywheel it would lose 180bhp throught the drivetrain...I think not.

Taking (from the graph) 7800 as the point maximum power is made, I calculate the flywheel power to be 223.43bhp.

Isnt it the weight that makes the difference? When i went to MOT the car was(waithout taking any unnecessary part from it) 1140KG including the fat Old man inside on the site and everywhere on the internet it says 1180 KG(as stock DC5) :?

No. You're thinking about the power to weight ratio, this only matters when moving the weight (the car) with the power produced by the engine.

any tips how are u calculating the BHP to WHP and WHP-BHP ?

To be honest I had it explained to me, if I were to try to explain it I feel I wouldn't do it justice and would only confuse the matter.

 

[acepty]

You don't lose a percentage of of power through the drivetrain. By your calculations if a DC5 was running 1000bhp at the flywheel it would lose 180bhp throught the drivetrain...I think not.
Taking (from the graph) 7800 as the point maximum power is made, I calculate the flywheel power to be 223.43bhp.

yes you are right is not a fixed % value
but there's no denying you do loose hp from the fly to the wheel due to the drivetrain, how much that's the question, I did say hypothetical percentage of 18% thow...
but obviously could be any given number depending on many factors as you might know...

if you go back a page in this topic and look at Jay82's example

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb28 ... n0001a.jpg

as you can see the figures it reads:

Maximum Power - Engine 253.3
Maximum Power - Wheels 222.4

that's equal to a 12.20% difference (loss) between fly and wheel HP figures...

or chalkie's example

he posted two graphics one read

Max 211.2 Flywheel power

the other

Max 176.2 Wheel power

again that's 16.57% difference between fly and wheel hp figures...

you say it has 223.43 at the fly from the 204.11 that this car peaked at the wheel that's 8.65% loss from Fly to wheel according to your estimate...
which would be below the average of the two examples I just showed above which is around 14.5%...
again not all cases all equal but I used it as a ruff guide for cases like this that it doesn't have both figures (@fly or @ the wheel)
if I needed to know one or the other...

anyway my main point was that the numbers are really high for a stock engine, what you think about that?

 

[Armenomania]

You don't lose a percentage of of power through the drivetrain. By your calculations if a DC5 was running 1000bhp at the flywheel it would lose 180bhp throught the drivetrain...I think not.
Taking (from the graph) 7800 as the point maximum power is made, I calculate the flywheel power to be 223.43bhp.

yes you are right is not a fixed % value
but there's no denying you do loose hp from the fly to the wheel due to the drivetrain, how much that's the question, I did say hypothetical percentage of 18% thow...
but obviously could be any given number depending on many factors as you might know...

if you go back a page in this topic and look at Jay82's example

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb28 ... n0001a.jpg

as you can see the figures it reads:

Maximum Power - Engine 253.3
Maximum Power - Wheels 222.4

that's equal to a 12.20% difference (loss) between fly and wheel HP figures...

or chalkie's example

he posted two graphics one read

Max 211.2 Flywheel power

the other

Max 176.2 Wheel power

again that's 16.57% difference between fly and wheel hp figures...

you say it has 223.43 at the fly from the 204.11 that this car peaked at the wheel that's 8.65% loss from Fly to wheel according to your estimate...
which would be below the average of the two examples I just showed above which is around 14.5%...
again not all cases all equal but I used it as a ruff guide for cases like this that it doesn't have both figures (@fly or @ the wheel)
if I needed to know one or the other...

anyway my main point was that the numbers are really high for a stock engine, what you think about that?

When i was surprised of the dyno result of my car,I went to few known mechanics,and they said that sometimes the engines come with more or less power from the factory. There ere never 2 k20as with the same power output.
The guy said even though the JDM DC2 makes 197hp,there were few he saw that made 197whp from stock :?
Anyway. . .dont think its a mistake cuz i drove my bro's dc5 with aem cai and mine with aem cai only,and it felt like 2 really different cars!
The difference in power was too much.
And above all,dont think that one of the most famous tuners would write about my car in his website "most powerfull stock dc5" if it wasnt correct. . .

 

[jay82]

well heres the chart from ai autosport
was very disappointed wit the map they did on the car, was never chasing figures but the car never had 250bhp :lol:

well the got it remapped when paul from tdi came to armagh n.ireland and i also removed the dc mani
the car feels 100 times better than it did and so much happier with the car now

 

[Armenomania]

well heres the chart from ai autosport
was very disappointed wit the map they did on the car, was never chasing figures but the car never had 250bhp :lol:

well the got it remapped when paul from tdi came to armagh n.ireland and i also removed the dc mani
the car feels 100 times better than it did and so much happier with the car now

224 HP flywheel? :shock:

 

[I-BEX]

specs:
dc sports header
greddy ti-c catback
hondata airboxmod
rbc manifold
dyno-tuned by a firm from germany

 

[VT-Doo]

Looking good, except your VTEC point is too low. Looks to be coming in at 4500rpm but would be better at about 5000rpm or even a touch either for a "kick".

 

[jay82]

well heres the chart from ai autosport
was very disappointed wit the map they did on the car, was never chasing figures but the car never had 250bhp :lol:

well the got it remapped when paul from tdi came to armagh n.ireland and i also removed the dc mani
the car feels 100 times better than it did and so much happier with the car now

224 HP flywheel? :shock:

good or bad 8-[
whats the differents between wheel and flywheel readings :lol:

 

[sydney]

On elites dyno my car was 33hp under from another dyno. 227hp on elites and 260hp on another. So i say jays is still around 250+hp mark. As long as it goes well on the road and good mpg thats the main thing. Paul is far better and experienced mapper than a.i.

 

[Armenomania]

well heres the chart from ai autosport
was very disappointed wit the map they did on the car, was never chasing figures but the car never had 250bhp :lol:

well the got it remapped when paul from tdi came to armagh n.ireland and i also removed the dc mani
the car feels 100 times better than it did and so much happier with the car now

224 HP flywheel? :shock:

good or bad 8-[
whats the differents between wheel and flywheel readings :lol:

Well,mate...
Considering the fact that dc5 is 220PS from stock (217 HP) you should have had more (if its flywheel HP) with all that mods and mapping you got
And Im sure it CAN'T be flywheel HP! :xcheers:

 

[jay82]

Well,mate...
Considering the fact that dc5 is 220PS from stock (217 HP) you should have had more (if its flywheel HP) with all that mods and mapping you got
And Im sure it CAN'T be flywheel HP! :xcheers:

in fairness i was never chasing figures in the first place, if it made 90hp but drove well i would of been happy. the first map was done by ai and it had 250hp and was like a pig. the v-tec kick in at 4500rpm and was gone by 5200rpm then kicked back in at 5900rpm then gone for good after about 6500 :xmad: and there was no way a smooth change over, it was like kick in the head :lol: even when driving at 30km/h it was jerky and was like it was being starved of fuel if you understand me. took the mani off and stuck the standard ecu back in problem solved
gave the car to paul explained all this to him and he said the cam angle and fueling and something eles was well out.
paul done completely new map for the car and she pulls like train now and i couldn't be happier with it \/

As long as it goes well on the road and good mpg thats the main thing.

couldn't of said it better =D>
we should get a rr day going here for sort of a meet here in ireland

 

[sydney]

yea im up for a rr day! be nice to meet a few people of the site and put a few faces to the names!

 

[madrab]

Armenomania? show me a stock dc5 engine that gives 217bhp, thats an owner manuals reference and that is achieved with the Japaneses higher ron fuel than we have over here, every engine will give out a different bhp reading, most loose bhp after a time.

you also have to take into the fact two dynos will never read the same, even the same dyno on a different day normally gives a different reading depending on weather conditions, air temp etc.

mines stock made 205bhp at the wheels standard apart from induction kit + exhaust very happy with that, as the a/f ratio etc look spot on and no problems

as long as the map looks good and everything is in the right place and it drives well then dyno bhp is just really pub talk

 

[raz786]

Armenomania? show me a stock dc5 engine that gives 217bhp, thats an owner manuals reference and that is achieved with the Japaneses higher ron fuel than we have over here, every engine will give out a different bhp reading, most loose bhp after a time.

you also have to take into the fact two dynos will never read the same, even the same dyno on a different day normally gives a different reading depending on weather conditions, air temp etc.

mines stock made 205bhp at the wheels standard apart from induction kit + exhaust very happy with that, as the a/f ratio etc look spot on and no problems

as long as the map looks good and everything is in the right place and it drives well then dyno bhp is just really pub talk

205bhp at the wheels? If so then that's pretty high for a stock car mate.

As Madrab says, each dyno reads differently, and I know a fair few read very low for some reason :?

 

[madrab]

sorry mate, meant to say at the fly, worked out to be around 190 at the wheels

 

[Armenomania]

sorry mate, meant to say at the fly, worked out to be around 190 at the wheels

on a dc5 that weights ~1200kg you dont loose 15hp only at the wheels!
Anyway,I have the dyno chart proving what I just said.
Maybe dyno over read that day, maybe not, but many cars did have logic results the same day on the same dyno, with the same temperature and humidity.
As you said, the dyno numbers are for the pub talk. the important thing is how the car goes!
[youtube]GwyAQzinscM[/youtube]
Not bad for the car with an ECU and basic breathing mods ONLY. no clutch, no flywheel, no internals....

 

[madrab]

exact figures of my dyno run were 205bhp at the fly, 187 at the wheels, so about 18 bhp loss

im not really sure what your argument is?, you slated a guys bhp reading saying it was low? even tho the map looked really good?
but then you go on to agree with me, saying bhp is pub talk, dynos do over read and differentiate, and as long as the car drives good and the map looks good then theres no problem? :S

 

[haitch]

187atw is more like 225@fly.